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Abilities and Tactics A place to discuss SK abilities such as Spells, AA\'s, and Melee as well as how to best use them.

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Old 05-26-2016, 12:03 PM   #1
Xanathol
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Default Suggestions / changes going into next expansion?

We're a long way away from the release of a new expansion but at the same time, we all also know that once beta starts, most is already set in stone, so we should start thinking up stuff now imo.


Just throwing some thoughts out there, in no particular order:

1. More ranks of quicker damage, particularly enough to lower our casting time on lifetaps further.

2. More ranks of Hastened Leechcurse Discipline (right now it is at 49.5 min reuse - needs to be WAY lower, like 12).

3. Remove proficiency penalties (for us, namely the penalties to 2her prof) - 'nough said.

4. Torrent / Theft line - the AC line came back (recourse needs to be moved to slot 7) but where are you attack line? Personally, I would love to see these combined into 1 spell that either debuffed both or was just a hard to resist dd, and the recourse changed to self only (so it can be more powerful). The recourse should be ac or a small percent based increase (ex. avoidance) & a hundred hand effect - it seems every melee has a form of HHE these days, Warriors are looking to add a form to DW, and Pallys have one on Valorous Rage... again, something we are without.

5. Complete rework of Carmine Rage. Compared to the other tanks' 'Rage' abilities, ours is by far the least powerful and we already have a plus spell damage ability that doesn't stack in visage of decay. Ideally, this would provide an increased chance to triple, flurry, and additional crit damage.

6. Upgrade to / change to Unholy Aura to also add an increased chance to crit & cripple. It is sad we're still the only tank without this...

7. Either allow the Thirst line of procs to stack with Shroud & Horror line or adjust it to its original idea, to provide an accuracy buff on the recourse. Scaling could be done by how long that buff lasts instead of a hit limit.



Tanking-wise, I think we're pretty healthy. Where we're lacking is in other areas of the game.
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Old 05-26-2016, 02:58 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xanathol View Post
We're a long way away from the release of a new expansion but at the same time, we all also know that once beta starts, most is already set in stone, so we should start thinking up stuff now imo.


Just throwing some thoughts out there, in no particular order:

1. More ranks of quicker damage, particularly enough to lower our casting time on lifetaps further.

2. More ranks of Hastened Leechcurse Discipline (right now it is at 49.5 min reuse - needs to be WAY lower, like 12).

3. Remove proficiency penalties (for us, namely the penalties to 2her prof) - 'nough said.

4. Torrent / Theft line - the AC line came back (recourse needs to be moved to slot 7) but where are you attack line? Personally, I would love to see these combined into 1 spell that either debuffed both or was just a hard to resist dd, and the recourse changed to self only (so it can be more powerful). The recourse should be ac or a small percent based increase (ex. avoidance) & a hundred hand effect - it seems every melee has a form of HHE these days, Warriors are looking to add a form to DW, and Pallys have one on Valorous Rage... again, something we are without.

5. Complete rework of Carmine Rage. Compared to the other tanks' 'Rage' abilities, ours is by far the least powerful and we already have a plus spell damage ability that doesn't stack in visage of decay. Ideally, this would provide an increased chance to triple, flurry, and additional crit damage.

6. Upgrade to / change to Unholy Aura to also add an increased chance to crit & cripple. It is sad we're still the only tank without this...

7. Either allow the Thirst line of procs to stack with Shroud & Horror line or adjust it to its original idea, to provide an accuracy buff on the recourse. Scaling could be done by how long that buff lasts instead of a hit limit.



Tanking-wise, I think we're pretty healthy. Where we're lacking is in other areas of the game.

1) Not a bad idea. I wouldn't mind seeing our taps drop down to 0.5sec cast time.

2) Agreed. Even to 30 min would be much much better.

3) I think we got what we got when it comes to proficiencies. I wouldn't expect us to have a better arrangement than the wars on this. Personally I am just thankful we got them to start with.

4) Yes. ATK tap would be nice if it stacked with Fero too. All in all I see this as very limited utility though.

5) Totally agree. We have VoD and Carmine. I do like that Carmine boosts melee and spell dmg, but its not a large boost to either. We really need a crit/crip disc like Paladins.

6) Yes, similar to #2, it needs more reuse reduction as well as some additional benefit.

7) Rather than accuracy boost, it should give a +dmg mod, last 2-3 ticks, and not be hit limited. Honestly, the leech portion of it doesn't matter at all and could go away. DD + dmg increase recourse would give excellent synergy with the crit/crip disc we need to get, as well as our existing leech tools. Needs to stack with other two proc buff lines.


These are some things rattling around in my head, some expansion related... others just stuff that needs fixed:

- Fix: A lot of classes with swarm pets have the power of the pets go up with every rank. Rangers, Beastlords, etc. Ours just gets longer and longer duration. Even if they last 10 min, swarm pets that hit for 200 are kind of useless. These need power scaled akin to other classes. We already have another AA line that extends them.

- Fix: SPA changes on some of our abilities like Theft of Defense proc and Skin proc so that they stack with other defensive abilities and not make us weaker. Hell, if they just refunded Theft of Defense and made the Theft of Life one fire on any detrimental spell (instead of just lifetaps) it would be a monumental upgrade for us.

- Fix: SK DoT revamp ASAP plzkthx. I want to melt shit with my mind.

- Fun idea: Spread the Hate - Large melee strike that drops us 5k agro and dumps it on Target's target. Something to use when we are DPSing. Kind of cheesy, I know.

- Suggestion: Toggle AA for ToTC innate lifetap proc on/off. Figured out this can be a major pain in the ass when trying to take down Balreth in Solteris very recently.


More to come as I have time / inclination.
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Old 05-26-2016, 03:28 PM   #3
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AA:
Hastened tap AA line
Hastened leechcurse
Hastened unholy aura
AA to add HHE to Unholy aura
AA to up the change that dots land, hate getting 2-3 resists especially with the mana change coming
More ranks of bloodthirsty blade
AA to make lifetaps .5 second cast
AA to make def/atk(new hopefully) taps .5 seconds
New rank of Tvyl’s to make it last more hits, mine wears off in about 4-6 seconds on a raid normally (hello swarm pets)
New cripple AA 20 min reuse lasts 30 seconds
Hastened veil of darkness
AA to make scourge skin instant cast
AA with a 1% chance to do leechcurse upon death if it is not on cooldown
AA to reduce recast of spears by 4 to 6 seconds

Spell
ATK tap
Up the spell dmg of carmine blade
Split debuff and dmg of dots into 2 different slots since we are all going to have less dots going after the revamps, ned to be able to use our debuff dot lines in raids, currently we cannot because the debuff is lower and thus gets resisted.
Agree with the move to slot 7 for ac on torrent, pisses me off that it messes with our pet buff.
New HHE disk if they won’t attach it to another disc/aa
New self buff same buff slot as vizat skin, but make it a rune that procs a rune that absorbs the same amount as vizat would have
Unlink spears
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Old 05-26-2016, 03:45 PM   #4
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Really good ideas guys - hopefully we can keep it flowing and submit a list to the devs.

Btw, I didn't mean to remove prof penalties just for us, but for everyone - just that 2her would be the only one that affects us, obviously. Sorry if I worded that poorly.

Another idea / alternative... give us staff block or an AA that let's us block with a 2her as with a shield. A lot of Warriors really want to be the dual wielding tanks - would be kind of neat if we were sturdier with a 2her, to encourage more 2her use for SKs.
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Old 05-26-2016, 07:58 PM   #5
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Make Harm touch mean something again, I wanna see it decimate an opponent like it did in Neriak Newb zone way back when.

Hates attraction, could not they make the fling portion of it work again just in group zones not in raids?
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Old 05-27-2016, 08:25 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flatchy View Post
Make Harm touch mean something again, I wanna see it decimate an opponent like it did in Neriak Newb zone way back when.

Hates attraction, could not they make the fling portion of it work again just in group zones not in raids?
I wish on both of those, but the powers that be have made it very clear neither of these will ever happen again, especially harm touch
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Old 05-29-2016, 01:53 PM   #7
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OK just this one more time
 
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30,000 character limit is WAY to small for thread like this.

Hum even small posts with copy/paste are showing breaking this limit, bug I think.




edit: This this only happens posting from word with the extra stuff there pasted to np++ then here worked fine.
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Old 05-29-2016, 02:14 PM   #8
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Will break up some old PM's and CRT posts of requests that we haven't received yet. Included what response at the time I got if any that I can relay.

32199 Touch of the Cursed – We were told this is now perma capped. Please reconsider. This is a key balance point and despite capping this ability we were not given anything new to compensate as its usefulness diminishes over the next level increase and gear upgrades. EQ is a game of small upgrades, this isn’t a % ability so just doing the normal 50hp base upgrade I feel is a completely reasonable ask.
(This got a probably can do)

41133 Mindless Hatred – This is an aggro ONLY aa that for some reason has a level cap. There is no stun/debuff component that can be abused here. This creates a situation where one our best aggro tools can’t be used on names and raid mobs. This is especially disconcerting with raid mobs as the raid game is where SK’s fall well behind other classes in usefulness. The aa was first released as level+5 then in beta it was changed to level+0 by mistake. When point out and corrected, it was then only changed to level+3 which imo is an unnecessary restriction. I think it is the only pure aggro ability in the game, for any class, that has a level restriction.
(This got a probably not)

38290 Voice of Thule While grateful for the changes, we have to use a buff slot to have aggro that others can generate without using up a buff. No warrior has asked for this, or needed it on a raid, in years. Consider at minimum a significant bump in the aa duration. Another option would be a self only version with a considerable extended duration. The best idea would be to make it an aura. I realize that won’t likely happen, but it would be a nice raid utility ability and would remove then need for SK's to have to use a needed buff slot.
(This got a probably not - Was before most recent chagnes)

41816 Presence of Fear
41820 Presence of Fear Fright Caster PB 1: Fear up to level 200
41818 Presence of Fear Mesmerization 1: Mesmerize up to level 105
This is a once every 5 min ability that requires us to get hit. Making the mez part of this aa 105 (level) and not 108(level+3) again is only penalizing us really in the raid game, which is where we need the most help. It is a 1 tick mez, meaning we really aren’t going to take over a mez role even from rogues or monks here. Both classes that mez longer and up to 108 currently without having to both get hit and have it proc or having the potential fear chaos.
(This got a I'm thinking about reworking it)
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Old 05-29-2016, 02:22 PM   #9
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Dot thoughts

Disease Dot/Debuff: Use as first tag Instant High Aggro + Aggro Dot – str/ac/poi/dis debuff – No Damage. Something similar to what we have but new and unique. This dot gives us solid tanking tool that fits with class lore.


Poison Dot: High Damage short duration dot change to “fast damage” group damage model with very high 2 tick damage –on raid mobs. SK’s shouldn’t need, and often aren’t allowed, to dot raid mobs.


Corruption Dot: High Damage short duration dot change to “fast damage” group damage model with very high 2 tick damage –on raid mobs. SK’s shouldn’t need, and often aren’t allowed, to dot raid mobs.


Snare Dot: Similar to current.
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Old 05-29-2016, 02:33 PM   #10
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Disease Spear: Quick cast helps but base refresh is still long.

Corruption Spear:
We really need another DD for damage delivery.

Big Tap: With current mob hit values anything > .5s leads to too many interrupts.

Sustain Tap: SK life tap line is currently disadvantaged to only heal us and not TOT. It should have the advantage of being a faster casting spell yet it is still way too slow.

AE Jolt – With the damage mobs do now the cast time is simply too long. As it is you are better served relying on ae jolts through our aa’s and single target taunt abilities for adds. For the spell to become viable again we really need the cast time instant .5s at the most. Upgraded version including a rune would be nice as well.

+1 to adding 100 hands to Carmine blade and/or Unholy Aura.

New Thoughts:

Aggro Viral DOT
- give unique SK way to pick up raid adds. MUCH less powerful now that swarming is removed from game.

Fear line – Return the fear spell line as a unique way for us to dangerously “control” adds. Some adds could be made stunnable/no fear and some made fear/no stun as well as mez/no mez. This would make us more useful especially with a no mez/no stun/fearable hard hitting add as well as add an element to figuring out new raids.

Hate's Revenge – New Buff – On the death of the SK a more powerful Project of Doom (SwarmPetDGSKProj) spawns, aggros, and attacks the mob that killed the SK.

Install Nightmare – New Buff – defensive proc buff that gives a xx% chance that a evil model mob of some sort will appear. This mob on spawn will take aggro (Unbroken Acrimony type effect) and have enough hp to take about 3s-6s of damage from a lv 100 mob (adjust by expansion)

General Synergy - tons of options here – we do X which makes other class/classes Y a whole lot better. I think from a lore perspective this doesn’t need to be us “helping” as much as it is us “piling on” or kicking a man while is down/shooting someone in the back/poisoning someone type of thing.

Thoughts:
  • Harm touch dot effect could add solid % damage to subsequent HT casts.
  • Corrupted flesh – Adds counters that will add % damage to the next # hits of a certain type.
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